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Thread: Mossflower and Martin, The Warrior

  1. #1

    Mossflower and Martin, The Warrior

    I'm confused. It would seem that Mossflower comes after Martin the Warrior. But in Mossflower, it says so many things that contrast Martin the Warrior. For example, in Mossflower, if I'm correct, it says that Luke left and Martin fought off searats. Finally, he left. It makes no reference to the fact that he was captured by Badrang. And I might be wrong, but I thought at the end of Martin the warrior, Martin quit being a warrior. But in Mossflower he is still a warrior. Which comes first? Why do they contrast eachother so much? Thanks.

  2. #2
    Patroller Nora the Rover's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Dacha in the backwoods
    Er...I hope I this won't be confusing...
    Martin never gave up being a warrior after Martin the Warrior, which took place first. In the book, he swore that he would never speak of his friends or Noonvale for the rest of his life, and pretended as if none of it had happened.
    In 'Mossflower', Martin traveled to Mossflower, and helped to fight off the wildcat Tsarmina. While being held in prison with Gonff, Martin mentioned that Felldoh had been one of his friends when he lived in the Northlands, but he didn't say anything else about his true adventures in the North. BJ wrote 'Martin the Warrior' after 'Mossflower', so it was somewhat difficult to write about the warrior mouse's history without having any mention of it in his previous book. That's probably why Brian decided that it would be best to give the impression that Martin decided to keep his past quiet because it had been so awful.

    It's a good idea to read the books in published order first, so as not to spoil secrets and other such things, but after reading them, it's best to read them over in chronological order. It can become a little confusing at times.
    If you must mount the gallows, give a jest to the crowd, a coin to the hangman, and make the drop with a smile on your lips.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Redwall Abbey
    Yep, all what Nora the Rover said. The stories couldn't match up perfectly because Mossflower was written before Martin the Warrior.
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  4. #4
    Patroller: Emeritus Lyrian Aryns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Just kinda adding on to what Nora said...

    In the last chapter of Martin's story in MTW, Martin said, "I will only say that I guarded my father's cave against searats while he was away. When I felt that he would not return I began my wanderings." Which pretty much matches the story he gives Gonff in Mossflower, so it sounds kinda like BJ looked back, and threw that line in there so everything worked...

    But that is the problem with 'making it up as you go along' with a nonlinear book series... inconsistancies like that are bound to come up.
    "She doesn't talk much, does she?"
    "No, she's always quiet. We think maybe there's something wrong with her."
    "Yes... or something very right. The quiet ones are the ones that change the universe, Luc Deradi. The loud ones only take the credit."
    -Babylon 5

  5. #5
    ok, thanks for clearing it up.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    mossflower was written before martin the warrior??????? now that makes me really confused. uh, sorry, i started reading the books in 2001 so all this is pretty new to me. can u guys please explain.
    let me just be me

  7. #7
    Patroller: Emeritus Furrtil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    It might help if you looked at the order of publishing and chronology.

    Published order
    Mariel of Redwall
    Martin the Warrier
    The Bellmaker
    Outcast of Redwall
    The Pearls of Lutra
    The Long Patrol
    The Legend of Luke
    Lord Brocktree
    The Taggerung
    Loamhedge (will be published soon)

    Check out or for more indepth stuff. Martin's done a really good job, he has timelines and everything.

    "One of the things Ford Prefect had always found hardest to understand about humans was their habit of continuously stating and repeating the very very obvious, as in It's a nice day, or You're very tall, or Oh dear you seem to have fallen down a thirty-foot well, are you all right?
    ~The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2003

    MTW, Mossflower

    freeverse Brian Jacques was peobably writing mossflower and he had an idea about martin the warrior so he mentioned some of it in Mossflower then it woud become more clear in MTW

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Good explainations. I only want to add that at the end of "Martin the Warrior," Martin didn't quit being a warrior, he only said that someday he might.

  10. #10
    This adds on to what has already been mentioned. Martin swore never to tell anyone about his past to protect Noonvale. Also, it mentioned in Legand of Luke that Martin suffered memory loss after fighting Tarsmina. WAIT!!! Does that mean that he forgot Rose!!! Okay, now I need someone to answer that

  11. #11
    Patroller Senav's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    The Station
    Memory loss? Oh, that. I think it just meant he had trauma of some kind. Martin isn't gonna forget Rose anytime soon, methinks.
    Pacific Ocean spotted off East Coast!

  12. #12
    Good! That takes a load off my mind.

  13. #13
    Patroller: General LordTBT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    its best to read them in publishers order.
    -Lord Trawnbull Thickstripe(TBT)

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